This means that its designed for rear wheel drive vehicles only. Will this hurt the trani? 6L80/90 - 8L90 Floor Tap Shifter Kit. - Scope testing the Ford 10R80. Running 12.60s at 111 is a fun ride! 10L80 Transmission. The 10L80 moniker is decoded. TCRA Annual Seminar Coming to Charlotte this April! Reproduction in whole or in part without permission is prohibited. The 10-speed first appeared in the 2017 Camaro ZL1 backing up the 650-horsepower, supercharged 6.2L engine. 2wd transmissions feature conical shaped tailhousings and an output yoke, which are replaced with a typically shorter 4wd style output shaft of varying lengths and spline counts, depending on the application. Wait 2 seconds. Customers' pictures and movies from drag racing competitions. Because of this, the 6L80 - despite having two or three more gears than its predecessors, is unexpectedly short in length. The Transmission Control Module (TCM) is an adaptive learning, 32-bit computer integrated into the valve body of the 6L80 / 6L90 and communicates with the Engine Control Module via the onboard vehicle CAN bus network. It can also be found in the Lincoln Navigator. 2) Trans vertical position is the same on 200-4R,700R4,4L60,4L65,70E,6L80E. GM states, ". But its interesting to note that there is a very low cover/piston failure rate for the 4L60-E TMBX converter. And with four gearsets and six clutches (2 brake, 4 rotating), the 10L80 10-speed has just one more clutch than the 8L90 8-speed transmission (this is partly because of a unique triple-clutch assembly mounted near the middle of the case). It's RPO code is "MYC" and it is domestically manufactured in GM's Ypsilanti, Michigan plant. They dealership gave Brian their opinion of what was making the noise. 2020 10l80 4wd an I one to convert to 2wd. Beginning with the F-150, it then made its way into the Mustang and the Expedition (as well as the Everest, and upcoming Ranger reboot). It has a line pressure tap for diagnostic purposes. JT. It is an incredibly advanced transmission and has the technology to . We are High Performance Transmission Builders During the inspection of the transmission, Brain noticed that the idler gear could be easily lifted off of the bearing with just the use of his fingers (see figures 2 and 3). Required fields are marked *. As such, Sonnax has a good view of both sides of the pump, so we are intimately involved with engineering solutions to both trending transmission AND converter issues. Joined Feb 11, 2007 Messages 11 Location . But before you have a brand induced meltdown, lets look at all the things that make the 10L80 transmission so unique. Always inspect the sump for possible evidence of debris that could indicate the pump drive gears could be failing. Members It employs an even deeper First gear ratio of 4.02:1 with tighter gear splits but does not apply an overdrive for subsequent gears. But look at the clutch pistons and spring dampers they are markedly different. But tall highway gearing arent the only way that this transmission maximizes efficiency. Smith began writing for Car Craft magazine in 1979 and became editor in 1984. Both 2wd and 4wd versions of the 6L80 can be used equally well, and there are no inherent advantages to either one once you have installed our adapter assembly. Beyond that, its probably not a good idea even if it will allow lockup because that clutch surface area is limited. August 8, 2022. Retiring Early The Transmission Industry Has Been a Dream Come True, A two-piece valve body with eight solenoids. For a type B code, the fault must be present after two consecutive ignition cycles, otherwise, the MIL will not illuminate (however, a pending code will store). Repeat Steps 3 through 9 six (6) additional times. Getrag 260 5-speed longitudinal manual made by Getrag. The transmission typically accepts a 6.3 quart fill. It is a heavy-duty version of the 6L80 six-speed automatic, with a strengthened input gearset which has two additional pinion gears for six total, and a strengthened output gearset, that uses wider gears than the 6L80. Honda CR-V Hybrid Racer Is an 800-HP Test Bed. Theres also a unique internal thermal bypass that allows the transmission to warm up faster, reducing fuel consumption on cold starts. Online Buyer's Guide All previous GM automatic transmissions were virtually all based on hydraulic controls, and received increasing electrical elements as they modernized. Looking for parts number : new shaft, copling et seal and where to find them. Spin losses (i.e. Unlike the 4L60E and 4L80E, the 6L80 is not always referred to as with the E on the end because its been over 25 years since the last non electronic GM transmission has been in production. Third 2.15 It's RPO code is "MYC" and it is domestically manufactured in GM's Ypsilanti, Michigan plant. Drive the vehicle until the engine and transmission reach normal operating temperature. Seems like the 6 speed auto would be better for the torque curve. Starting with the 2017 Ford F-150, the 10R80 transmission was an option. Commanded engine torque: Directly affects shift scheduling, TCC scheduling, and transmission diagnostics. Its good for a 12.69 @ 111 mph in cool dry weather.I go down the track with the lock up switch off. If you have any questions that I may be able to help you with, drop a comment or contact me. Thats more than almost any other GM automatic transmission. This is an immediate DTC that effects emissions. That is just the beginning. The transmission can also signal the engine to drop power during a shift if there's a possibility of clutch damage. One common 6l80 issue due to design flaws include premature clutch failure. How is this different from the GM 6L80E transmission that is used in the Corvette or in the newer GM trucks? Heres what we mean: Lets assume we have a TH-400 trans in our Chevelle with a 4.10:1 rear gear. As a result, it became a popular choice despite sharing most of its internal components with its predecessor, the 700R4. What is most welcome about it is that it is a very durable, functional and impressive transmission assembly and appears to have a terrific prospect with GM and the aftermarket community. The transmission lacks a direct-drive, but features two overdrive gears. The transmission is automatically shifted featuring performance algorithms to minimize upshifts during closed throttle driving to prevent unnecessary shifting. Ive heard a little about thisdid they add two more gears to the transmission? All of the 1998-up cases used behind the LS family of engines used the separate bellhousing style of case. I would be willing to get it rebuilt, but want it to function like it should (not back to the way it came from GM). 10R80 transmission swap? When its enabled at low speeds the exhaust tone becomes muffled, the AFM valves clatter open and closed, v4 vibration and increased injector noise is nothing but annoying, especially with a convertible. Each clutch is controlled by a corresponding shift solenoid A-F. 10L80 Transmission Specs General - 10-speed automatic with integral turbine clutch torque converter Application - RWD & 4WD / AWD RPO Code - MF6 Production Began - 2017 Case - 1 piece aluminum with integrated bell housing Torque Converter - 260 mm with Electronic Controlled Capacity Clutch (10L80 ECCC) If the transmission fluid is discolored or has evidence of debris in the fluid, it would be recommended to replace the torque converter and flush the system to complete this repair. The way the power is applied is different than the 4L80E / TH-400. 6L80, 6L90 Transmission Tech Advisory: Consider an Updated Converter in Your Next Rebuild We all know that automatic transmission failures can have many root causes. GM LS1 - LS9 / Chrysler Gen III and Viper V10, Conversion. AM-DT-51190 threads into that port and connects to the J-45096 TransFlow. DESIGNED FOR GEN V LT1 & LT4 ONLY. The 6L80 transmission pan is similar in shape but the 6L80 is shorter at 17 1/2 inches. I didnt realize that it came equiped with such a lame gear ration 3.08. TAP-2000 is a floor mounted shifter with Tap up Tap Down for GM 6/8L80/90E transmissions. Indirectly affects TCC control and shift control. The 6L80 is a robust transmission and can handle a ton of power. Be aware of your output shaft version before proceeding with any adaptation. A typical scene thats now playing out in transmission shops across the country goes something like this: A late-model, full-size truck or SUV is dropped off to get the transmission checked out. document.write("- "+yr); Accelerate from a stop with light throttle (15%), ensuring that upshifts 1st through 8th occur at engine speeds between 1300-1600 rpm. Thread starter 2nazty; Start date Nov 26, 2018; Nov 26, 2018 #1 2. This is a normal and desired behavior. But, GM had been in transmission limbo, so to speak, needing a modern transmission to fill the duty gap between the excellently versatile4L60E (and its tougher 4L65 & 4L70 variants)and the Allison transmissions. Did the converter clutch material just wear out, thus allowing the clutch and cover to go metal-on-metal? LS 3 has a Big Turbo on it, I am only worried about rear gear, rest I have help with, Car never went over 130 or it red lined with Big Block, Never was a highway car, It has a 373 or a 323 in it, Not a 411 I know that much, Thats all, Im building a gen one Camaro and Ive purchased lt4 supercharged motor for it I was wanting to know if you know the difference in size for 10 speed transmission to a turbo 400 I need to know how much to raise my floor pan at tunnel and about how much fire wall to cut out. Thats pretty much all thats to it. Eighth 0.85 While converter failures are not uncommon with other transmission families, you are thinking that this is really becoming a pattern for the 6L80, 6L90. - Critical wear areas and vacuum test locations: GM 10L and Ford 10R series. The 6L80 denotes that the transmission is a 6-Speed, Longitudinally mounted, and for 8000 lbs. The complaint A 2005 Ford F350 with the 6.0 liter diesel engine and 5R110W transmission has set a P0753 Pressure Control Solenoid A Electrical Fault code and a P2700 Transmission Friction Element A Apply Time Out Of Range code. Or did the OE stamped steel cover and piston flex and twist to the point that the clutch surface was not flat, causing a premature friction failure? The 6L80Es gear rations are as follows: There are two super easy ways to tell whether or not the transmission is a 6L80E. 6L80E Torque Converter Power Raptor Full Size Non-Billet Number 88-6L80-1, now with Billet Cover Option. Hi Jeff, What all needs to be done to change it from four-wheel-drive to 2 Wheel Dr? The 6 speed takes a fair amount of trans tunnel work and my Holley Dominator ECU can't control it. This is a completely new and different transmission compared to the 4L80E. Its a longitudinal transmission (thats what the L in 6L80E stands for). and it can handle a total gross vehicle weight of 8,600 lb, which makes it a great transmission for LS swaps with no modification needed whatsoever. RATIOS 4.70, 2.99, 2.15, 1.80, 1.52, 1.28, 1.00, .85, .69, .64. 1. Electronic challenges exist when mixing and matching the 6L80 as they must be matched to their particular engine. This idler gear and ball bearing assembly is mounted to the stator shaft support housing. Gilbert, For both types A and B, a freeze-frame record will be stored in memory if the MIL illuminates. Reverse 4.87. Its a little tough to see, but the thickness of the pistons is also different. OPTION 2- The newer and still somewhat mysterious 6L80e has a very enticing ratio selection (4.02, 2.36, 1.53, 1.15, 0.85, 0.67) that should allow the engine to stay within it's "power band" resulting in more usable power. With this in mind, there are (3) major groups of failure management strategies that are used when certain diagnostic trouble codes are present. Our transmission shop specializes in rear wheel drive Ford & GM high performance transmissions. The following drivability conditions will be present when this type of DTC is stored. The question is will the 10L80 be as strong as the 10L90? But keeping the engine in its ideal RPM range allows the 10L80 transmission to operate with nearly the efficiency of a CVT transmission. or gross weight of 14,000 lbs. The drive gear and idler gear with the bearing are not sold separately. GM has been useless to say the least, and waited me out (now off warranty). and the maximum output torque is 664 ft. lbs. All this is handled with application of planetary ratios. Its been on the road for a few years, and were starting to see some common failures for this unit. The 1-piece aluminum case houses a slim 260mm 10L80 torque converter inside the integrated bell housing. vehicle weights. The thicker JMBX piston cant conform to the cover (like it can in the 4L60-E TMBX), and at a commanded slip rate of approximately 50 RPMs in lockup, there is ultimately metal-to-metal contact that occurs between the front cover and the piston. Im with you on AFM is crap. Thanks Jeff. The complaint is usually associated with the vehicle sitting for a while (after it has been running at operating temperature). I am currently planning on a high compression LS2 and a progressive nitrous kit but before another 4L80E goes in there is a 6,8, or 10 speed not an option? But in order to make this work properly, they began by making the overall First gear ratio deeper. It is currently phasing out the 6L80/6L90 transmissions (although it hasn't done its all the way yet. Im thinking 3.73. The GM 10L80/90 transmissions began production in 2017, meaning that were closing in on six years of this transmission being on the road. After a prolonged drive time, DTC P0752 Pressure Control Solenoid A Stuck On. There may or may not be codes associated with these complaints. and can weigh up to ~230 lbs. How quickly time passes by. TSB 18-NA-026 Transmission fluid leak Thats a great question. Hi Jeff, I have a 2016 Silverado with the 5.3 and the 8 speed transmission. The ideal upgrade for modified performance vehicles, Sonnax 3-bolt adapter flange yoke kit T35-GMFD-01K makes it easy to convert a two-piece driveline to a one-piece, U-joint-style driveline. Accelerator pedal position: Directly affects shift scheduling, TCC scheduling, and transmission diagnostics. It can also be controlled under DSC, or Driver Shift Control, e.g., "tap shifting". Please help>> I have a 2013 GMC yukon. This wavy nature of the clutch surface is made worse with many miles of usage. 2018 YUKON DENALI 64K ON THE MILES HAS A CLICKING NOISE AT A IDLE LIKE A CRACKED FLYWHEEL OR SOMETHING BOUNCING IN THE PAN CHEVY PUT NEW EXHAUST ON IT THINKING IT WAS IN THE CONVERTER ALSO PUT A NEW PUMP IN THE TRANS THIS SOUND IS NOT THE SAME EVERY TIME SOUNDS LIKE A BOUNCING BOLT SINCE THE PUMP WAS IN STALLED NOW SEEMS TO OLY MAKE NOISE WHEN WARMED UP MY SON IS A TRANSMISSION MAN HE SAYS IT A SOUND THEY MAKE WHEN THEY ARE SUCKING AIR NOT SURE ON THAT I WAS A MECHANIC FOR MANY MANY YEARS CANT FIGURE THIS OUT NOR CAN GM ANY THOUGHTS ON THIS ? Maximum shift speed is 6500 RPM. If thats the case, the valve body will have to be replaced to correct these concerns. Diagnosis and correction of a max line pressure condition may become, With Hondas 10-speed front wheel drive transmission (see Figure 1, above) going into its fifth year on the roads, its feasible that one may show up in your shop for service. You might run into a lack of valve body repair options. And you are correct the converters in these units are experiencing a high percentage of failure and are more problematic than normal. Newer to the transmission world is its use of direct clutch-to-clutch shifting and the total lack of bands. Upon full inspection, the unit is loaded with metal, and the pump (bell housing) is worn to the point of needing remachining or replacement. Quick 4 Stand-Alone Transmission Control System The Chevrolet Performance 6L80E trans comes with a set of wiring harness adapters and a flash drive that is used to configure the transmission to be used behind a GM LS engine in a rear wheel drive application. It also contains a durable transmission pan, reliable gear seat, EPC, a 13-vane pump assembly, high-performance cooler, hardened stator shaft with rings and specialized control solenoids. The TCM is actually even programmed to adjust its operation for transmission clutch wear. Lots of good information I do have one question That no one seems to be able to give a good answer to. So why does the JMBX converter have this chronic problem? The 4L80 features a 310 mm torque converter. Transmission Pan Bolt Set Chevy 6L80E 6L90E 8L80E 8L90E 10L80E 10L90E 18pcs. The stator shaft support housing is fitted with a converter drive gear and idler gear. More or less a TT V8 german car so if the new 8 or 10 speed GM transmission would work where the 6L80E came originally and the CTS V, SS Sedan, and ZL1 Brembo brakes work it could be a great platform. TIPM Problems! If the power circuit to the transmission solenoids fails open, then all solenoids are failed electrically off. Also fits '05-'06 Pontiac GTO (differential side). Swapping to this transmission is currently difficult from an electronic control standpoint. At the current time, the only way to use a GM 6 or 8-speed automatic is to tie it in with a GM engine like the LS3 and use the engine controller to work with transmission. A more recent issue with these units is pump drive gear failure (Figure 7). Gears Magazine With a dry weight of approximately 230 lbs, its also very light considering the complexity. Dissecting the E-Ray, the First Hybrid AWD Vette. Case 1 piece aluminum with integrated bell housing Indirectly affects shift scheduling and TCC scheduling. What is a good torque converter today for a 4.3 high output 4 wheel drive Blazer? Chevrolet Transmission Dimensions Dimension "C" is the distance from the bellhousing to the center of the transmission mounting pad. $499.00. Thx While not new to the 6L80, it uses an Input Speed Sensor to monitor input speeds to compare against engine speed and Output Shaft Sensor speed, using this data to adjust shift speeds under instantly detectable conditions. Which one you use is going to depend on whether or not the transmission is in or out of the vehicle. Shift the transmission to Drive. Fluid pressure is maintained by an off-axis main pump that can vary the displacement depending on the load. In 2018 and later models with the transmission warmer mounted to the transmission, there can be a concern with coolant leaking under the vehicle. Most full-size trucks and SUVs with a 6L80, 6L90 use a JMBX full-size (300mm) style converter.